BENELUX - Music from Belgium, Netherlands & Luxembourg

[kh0815]

Aren't "Low Countries" = (Kingdom of) Netherlands (English) = (Koningrijk) Neederlande (Dutch) = (Königreiche) Niederlande (German) = (Royaume) Pays-Bas (French) = NL (on the cars)?

Belgium + Neederlande + Luxemburg = Benelux - an early example of (some) United States of/in Europe.

[klavierelch]

Interesting discussion. Originally I wanted to name the thread "Music from the BENELUX countries" which would have been a plain translation of what we call Belgium, the Netherlands and Luxembourg in Germany (I think it is the same in France).
But several dictionaries said that the translation of BENELUX should be Low Countries which sounds like a plain English translation of the German word "Niederlande" for the Netherlands. I assume the term was originally used for the Netherlands and the flemish part of Belgium.

So I am a bit confused now: is Luxembourg and the Walloon part of Belgium included in the English term "Low Countries" or not? Englishmen to the front please!

[rob]

...So I am a bit confused now: is Luxembourg and the Walloon part of Belgium included in the English term "Low Countries" or not? Englishmen to the front please!

I made a joke at the expense of Luxembourg and it seems to have caused the renaming of this thread!!! Has Luxembourg ever given birth to any composers of significance?

My understanding of the term 'Low Countries' in the UK is that it refers to those countries nearby which are extremely prone to flooding. So no, it doesn't include Luxembourg, but I would usually take it to include both the Flemish part of Belgium and Wallonia. 'Benelux' is a term perfectly well understood in the UK although perhaps rarer now that the EU has expanded.

[fredbucket]

Has Luxembourg ever given birth to any composers of significance?

They would seem to think so ... http://www.lgnm.lu/html/composers/index.html

Regards
Fred

[Roeland]

Although my remark may come a bit late: lowest country in the Benelux is the Netherlands. The Belgian Ardennen are too high to say that Belgium is low.In the Netherlands there are a few "hills" like near Vaals in the south and near Arnhem, but for the rest the country is flat, flat and flat again. Belgian Jacques Brel sang about "Mijn vlakke land"(my flat country): there he meant Vlaanderen, wich is flat for example at the seaside.

[lutoslawski]

I think that the thread would be better named Music from Western Europe, which might include all these countries, no?

Tony

[kh0815]

I think that the thread would be better named Music from Western Europe, which might include all these countries, no? Tony

Nonononononono, please! What about El Hierro (Canarian island, belonging to Spain, in the extreme West), Portugal, Spain, Andorra, France, Ireland, even GB, much more in the West than Benelux countries?

P. S. Would our dearest Tony be willing to open an Andorra thread? Any contributions? Wiki fans: go ahead!

[Jean-Séb]

I think that the thread would be better named Music from Western Europe, which might include all these countries, no? Tony

Nonononononono, please! What about El Hierro (Canarian island, belonging to Spain, in the extreme West), Portugal, Spain, France, Ireland, even GB, etc., much more in the West than Benelux countries?

Maybe what Tony points out is that we Europeans may seem a bit provincial when seen from far away (I think Tony is in Asia). We do not have a thread for Music from Nebraska and Iowa, for exemple, and we have only two threads for the whole South-American continent but we tend to multiply the threads regarding Europe. But there are significant historical and musical reasons for that.
Jean-Séb

[rob]

As Jean-Seb says, there are good historical reasons why the countries of central and western Europe predominate here. 'Classical' Art-Music, with which this site concerns itself, seems largely an Italian/German/French invention, so that's where the greatest concentration of composers are found, even now!

There are many different kinds of music in this increasingly tiny world of ours, and all varieties are of course welcome - igod82 being one of our main researchers in this field. Personally I would be quite happy to see every country (or de-facto state) to have its own thread on here - it would only be two hundred & something in total - but members will find it difficult obtaining music from, let's say, Nauru, Bhutan, Kosovo, Surinam, Burkina Faso, Kiribati - to name just some random examples.

If any threads become unwieldy then I am quite happy splitting them into constituent parts if that seems useful - that may be the case with both this thread and the South American thread. This is the great advance that this software has made possible.

Meanwhile members have been very reticent to open new threads. Please do some research before doing so to ensure a need, avoiding overlap, contacting an admin if necessary or unsure; but we are very young in this incarnation and really could do with a greater diversity of threads rather than less.

Rob

[Roeland]

As Jean-Seb says, there are good historical reasons why the countries of central and western Europe predominate here. 'Classical' Art-Music, with which this site concerns itself, seems largely an Italian/German/French invention, so that's where the greatest concentration of composers are found, even now!

Rob, I am afraid that you make a mistake here. Don't forget that in the late Middle Ages and (early) Renaissance several composers from the Netherlands and Belgium (in those days these countries were both together "De Nederlanden") were important for the development of classical music: Ockeghem, Sweelinck, Dufay etc. Especially when you speak about "invention" I wouldn't oversee this period of time. And don't forget British composers like Gibbons and Byrd! The music of that era may not be most popular in this forum, but that seems to be mainly a matter of ingratitude